Topic [76] RV uses in business TKR Remote Viewing Forum July 2003

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Scott_Ellis, somewhere around July 29, 2003

Hi All,

So does anyone have experience using RV to help them in their business or career?

The typical questions I would like to be able to answer are always of the type that seem to want an ARV type of approach, such as:

Will this product be successful?
Will this business be successful?
Should I work at company A or company B?
Should I change my career and do X?

I'm not comfortable trusting ARV to answer such important questions because of displacement.  Also, if the answer is NO and you didn't take the action, there would be no event to ARV.  But are there other ways to address questions such as these?  Also, what other professional uses have any of you found?

Scott

Ertai, somewhere around July 30, 2003

Hey scott

Try it for the stock market, Like predicting month changes on the Dow or Nasdaq (UP or DOWN)

Try both ARV and normal RV

But of course its best to use this in blind sessions, so you better but those targets in a big target poll and get a random one until you find those

And of course you can use RV to check on the newspaper/street/company for a job that gives you the best paycheck/worktime
something like that

With RV there is plenty of choices for use in your career

Scott_Ellis, somewhere around July 31, 2003

Hi Ertai,

If I could depend on ARV to work reliably I would have retired already.  But since it is wrong so frequently, I certainly wouldn't trust any major business or life decision to it.  Nor would I consider it as a valid piece of informational input in any major decision.

>And of course you can use RV to check on the >newspaper/street/company for a job that gives you the >best paycheck/worktime
>
> With RV there is plenty of choices for use in your career

Please elaborate.

I just don't see the opportunities for RV once you discount ARV.  In general it's because RV sessions simply aren't that good - RV is way oversold (that could be it's own thread).

I think it would be next to impossible to determine a product to develop with RV.  I think it would be almost impossible to figure out which company to approach for partnering, getting a job, etc.  without ARV.  Think about it, aren't the resources required to apply context to RV data for that type of question far beyond the ability of an individual?  How many times has RV successfully found a missing person?  There may be some accurate data in RV sessions about their surroundings, but how often did the RV data lead them to the body?

But I would desparately like to find some practical applications.  If there were practical applications, then I'll bet RV would gain mainstream acceptance very quickly too.  The only applications I can think of are statistical like the stock market.

Scott

Scott_Ellis, somewhere around July 31, 2003

Hi EC,

I think you have a very valid point that intuition is valuable.  It's undoubtedly something that we all use to varying degrees.

But still I would really like to find a practical application for RV in my career.  Again, I would love to use it for making decisions, but since ARV is frequently wrong I tend to rule it out.

Scott

wizopeva, somewhere around July 31, 2003

You can always try rv for situations in which you can't decide anyway.  Sometimes there is so little info that any decision is a big gamble.  In such a case, you would have little to lose by trying rv.
-E

River, somewhere around August 1, 2003

You could always use RV to find out where all those missing biro's end up.  ;-)

Liz

Ok I'll try and think of a better use for RV at work. LOL

River, somewhere around August 1, 2003

Hi EC,

the main and number one rule with RV is that you must do it blind to the target.

This makes it very difficult to just RV on the spot, unlike using intuition.

Intuition or psychic abilities are used in the same way when RVing only we aren't allowed to know what we are working on.

I use my intuition and psychic abilities all the time for work and home and .........er.......just about everything I think. LOL
But I can never find a real use for RV in everyday life because to get an answer to something using RV I would first have to put the question into a pool of other targets and pick one at random.

I may not get the question answered for a very long time using this method and it's much easier to just follow my intuition in the first place like you do.

I would have to say that, for me, intuition is far more practicle in everyday life but RV is good for different kinds of problems and situations.

Liz

River, somewhere around August 1, 2003

Hi BC,

[quote] SO, RV and ituition are two completely different beasts[/quote]

Well, kinda sorta.  :-/

Intuition is used while Remote Viewing.  Remote viewing is just using intuition without knowing what you are viewing or answering, so the conscious mind can't interfere as much.  :)

What you are doing is fantastic and probably the better option for what you are using it for.

Can you think of anything you could use 'blind' RV for at work? I must say I'm stuck for a good answer.

Yet simple intuition is handy all the time don't you think?

Liz

energycritter, somewhere around August 1, 2003

Well, considering that I am not real good at applying terms correctly, I am not sure that I know what RV could be apllied to at work. Well, something that Joe M. does come to mind, and it is seemingly an intuitive moment more than an RV thing considering your last post on this thread.

Joe mentions in his RV secrete book an old plane that may have the need to be checked for cracks in the frame. Instead of wet-mag-partical inspection of the entire frame, a person could RV the entire plain, find cracks and then wet-mag the area in question to cut to the chase, so to speack, thereby saving the company hundreds of dollwrs by finding cracks before the entire plane had to be inspected and that would have cost more, especially if the plane was inspected in a way that made the cracks the last thing they found after having spent laa of the money on wet-maging the good parts of the plane. Someone with more english skills could have writen that in one sentence... ::)

Anyway, my point is, how would that inspection of possible cracks via RV been RV as opposed to intuition. I am now confussed about the difference, since the line between the two seems to be very thin and releative to the actual details to the technique or method applied at the time.

Maybe this thread will be submitted to Joe... :-/

So, I guess you are correct, RV can not be used for work.....or can it....aaaaaahhhhhhhh??????????

???


OH well, at least it may be possible to say that we all would be in a world of hurt if we didn't have the intuition stuff to use daily.

The line between RV and intuition is thin, so thin.....or is it....OK....I am dropping this thread.....I will practice RV at home, blind, with a target pool and exercise intuition at work with an idea of what it is that I am wanting to know.  :-/

BC the confussed energycritter

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 1, 2003

I'm starting a new thread for this question....
RV vs. Intution  See ya all there ~

River, somewhere around August 1, 2003

Hey EC what happened to your posts that I was replying to?

They were great! Did you wipe them? I loved them, they were so inspiring!  They were some of the best post on the board because they told of real life uses for intuition. They would have been so helpful to a lot of people???

Doh!

Don't for a minute be upset because you are confused about the differences between intuition and RV. It's common.......really common.  :)

I'll move over to where PDPJ has started RV v Intuition and talk about it over there.

cheers Liz

Fire, somewhere around August 2, 2003

Hi Scott,

On RV in business, I think there is a slightly larger issue that complicates the issue.  Just my two cents here...

The kind of information you are talking about acquiring is certainly possible.  However, there is a certain level of viewing skill required, certainly, that is the first and biggest issue.  And there is a certain amount of retasking, or multiple viewers with different tasking, required for the kind of context necessary, that is the second biggest issue.  A moderate amount of both, mixed together well, would probably do ok.

I think the average person learning RV is of a skillset that might give them a few opportunities here but in a very limited form; it really would require a 'team' approach to RV to come up with the genuine "detail on future bet your money on it context of concept" kind of RV info you would want for business applications.

I don't think it's necessary to use ARV on something like product development or concept.  I would think ARV is best suited to targets which, even when accurately viewed, don't produce an answer easily discernable in session analysis.  (E.g., describing a baseball game would likely include all its elements, including both winning and losing team colors or mascots, which might make it difficult even for a real nice session to provide a clear answer.)  

A product can be directly viewed.  Using ARV for something like product concept would infer you already knew the concepts and were merely choosing which one was the answer.  Maybe none of them are the answer, or not in their current form.  So that approach seems like more harm than help to me.

Many of your questions are binaries.  You could approach them with a variety of other psi tools, such as dowsing, runes or i-Ching for example--not for a hard answer, but for additional insight, at least.  Binary questions have some inherent issues in tasking though which make even good viewing sometimes a problem just because the questions are at issue.  Somewhere....

Here it is, this is something ancient I wrote up on blind binary tasking, I'm no world expert on anything but it mentions what I'm talking about, concerning potential complications in asking a question of the future:

[hr]
An Example of How to Review Your Binary Tasking

Most questions are more complex than they seem. For example, say the first question-thought is, [u]Will Company X purchase the land next to my home?[/u] In reality, there are many questions and inferences in there.

Length of Time. They might not purchase it this week, but they could in a year, or in 120 years. To avoid ambiguity a specific time span (e.g., "prior to Dec. 31, 2005?") should be added.

Dated Changes. Nothing is impossible -- you might end up owning a home elsewhere by that date even through the most unlikely of circumstance, and they could buy the land next to that. (e.g., "next to my current house?").

Variable Options [1]. The company itself might not buy the land. The company might have divisions or owned corporate entities which technically are the ones who purchase the land. (e.g., "Company X or any now-or-later related identity")

Variable Options [2]. The company doesn’t have to buy the land. They may end up leasing it for 40 years from the county, for example. They may trade the owner for another property the company holds. You just don’t know. (e.g., "acquire or actively utilize the land")

Variable Options [3]. Maybe in the end, it won’t be the land. They might buy mineral rights, they might buy right-of-passage, or other options that is not the land itself. This aspect is slightly covered in (d) but just bear in mind you should question every word of your question to see what hidden assumptions it might contain.

Variable Options [4]. Just to be specific, give a little more detail about that land’s placement or object than ‘next to’. There are at least 4 areas "next to" your home.

Variables Options [5]. What if the company buys part of the land in question?

The Actual Question [1]. You may be asking the wrong question entirely. If you expect that Company X would build commercial property on the land if they acquired it, and your question is related to your feelings about or interests in that outcome, then what you really want to know is not whether they acquire it, but simply whether commercial properly will be erected on that land within a certain time period. Technically, your interest may be in the usage of the land, not the corporate details.

The Actual Question [2]. If your end-result interest is based on new commercial property improving your property value, then the question you should ask is about your current property’s future value, not about the land.
[hr]

But it could be interesting to try some business or product related taskings just for fun, to see how things come out.  Very shortly we'll have quite a tasking/practice/session area in the Galleries area of TKR (coming soon to a screen near you :-)).

PJ

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 2, 2003

    How neat is this???  I was going to introduce a topic having to do with intent, forming questions and probing the into the future.....  and now I won't. LOL   ;-)

    Is mind reading allowed in this forum??  ;)

Fire, somewhere around August 2, 2003

I know what you're thinking.

And you.  YES YOU OUT THERE.  I mean you.

LOL.  PJ

wizopeva, somewhere around August 2, 2003

However, I can easily bypass this problem by doing a few sessions BEFORE the tasking is unknown.   Pru called this wildcards.  Then later when a target comes up, I just assign one of the wildcard sessions to it and look it over.  That's how I was able to find my missing passport that one time when I really needed it.  I just assigned a wildcard session to it.  
-E




[quote]Hi EC,

the main and number one rule with RV is that you must do it blind to the target.

This makes it very difficult to just RV on the spot, unlike using intuition.

Intuition
Liz

[/quote]

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 2, 2003

Eva, please explain what wild cards are and how they are used. I read your posting but don't understand what I read  :-/

River, somewhere around August 3, 2003

Oh Eva that's brilliant!  ;-)

Liz

wizopeva, somewhere around August 6, 2003

Pru figured out that you can do a session on a target that has not been decided yet.  -)o the session as normal.  You can make up a target ID for it if you like.  Then LATER on someone might email you for a session or maybe you see a target is up on some mailing list, or maybe you have some kind of problem or question you want to address.  Well at that point, you then assign the target ID of the session you already did to the new target.  Basically, it's the same as normal rv except for you do the tasking later.  I just leave some of these wildcards sessions in my drawer and always put new ones on the bottom.  The rule is when I assign tasking, I always grab from the top of the pile sessions so that I will not be tempted to pick and choose.  The main danger is that you might try to self select the sessions to match the new target.  That would compromise the blindness.  I usually forget 99% of what's in my sessions shortly after I do them, so I don't worry about that so much anyway as long as I make the rule to not try to sort them.  So I just keep these sessions around for emergencies.  I often add to the pile but I also often take off the top and assign to normal blind targets off the net.  That way when I do the sessions, I can't even assume it will be for an ops type target either.  Pru named this way of doing it wildcards.  WHen done with a second person, it can become totally blind as the session is done before the tasking and then the tasking is done without knowledge of what's in the session.  
-E

 


[quote]Eva, please explain what wild cards are and how they are used. I read your posting but don't understand what I read  :-/[/quote]

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 8, 2003

ahhhhh haaaa!   ;-)  Thanks  ;-)

Fire, somewhere around August 8, 2003

I sometimes think most sessions should be wildcard.  It actually ensures a good protocol, since there is NO possible way that some of the most common dangers-- contamination like from a non-blind monitor, over frontloading, AOL from tasker/situation, etc. -- can happen.  

Most the RV stuff done in the lab that I hear about has been done precog like this for quite awhile, because it renders moot all the arguments skeptics had about pollution & collusion.  

If the viewer does a session at 10am from the east coast, and a computer in southern california truly- randomly generates a decoy set at 11am, and the judge (in northern california) makes a decision about what the session (faxed and compared to the computer's display of decoys) best by 11:30 am, and the computer then randomly chooses one of that set to be the target at noon --

-- there is no way all the common excuses leveled at such research, such as someone knowing and telling the viewer what the target is -- can even be possible.  I also think working steadily precog in any fashion helps people get their brain unwrapped about the time issue and the assumption it matters.

PJ

cautious, somewhere around August 8, 2003

Hi Fire,

" I sometimes think most sessions should be wildcard.  It actually ensures a good protocol, since there is NO possible way that some of the most common dangers-- contamination like from a non-blind monitor, over frontloading, AOL from tasker/situation, etc. -- can happen. "

I still have trouble with this tasking.  Not that I'm convinced that it doesn't work.  But to me it just seems to add yet another thing to get, when this stuff is hard enough as it is.  Of course what I'm saying assumes that a "known" target, or at least known when the session is done, is easier to get than having to first "locate" what target IS going to be chosen in the future then viewing that.  I guess what I'm saying is that I sense that the more layers there are to a tasking or the more variables, such as happens with a future target, the more difficult it will be to get accurate data.

BTW, how do folks highlight quotes they have taken from someone as I did here with you, when using them in their posts?

Gene

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 8, 2003

    I didn't realize what I did had a name  'wildcard', but now that I know what it's called, I can say for sure that it worked. I did it as an experiement.

    I was in this class and every week we had a target to do.  A few weeks prior, there was some confusion about getting the targets ready by a certain date/time.
On the session I am talking about, no notice was sent that the target was ready ~ yet I felt that this was an oversight and in fact, there was a target.

    I didn't know if I had a email glitch or what. I thought about this and decided that if there was a target, then I don't really need the coordinate numbers. All I need to do is have the belief that the target existed and just do it...which is what I did.

    I was the only one who came prepared and I did super well with it.  It's the little experiences like these that builds our faith.  I wouldn't have the understanding of the belief of this working if I hadn't had the actual experience.  This is much stronger than reading that such and such a method works.

    I will have to try this somemore....take it a step further as Eva explained.

you make the quotes like this:  when you see what you want to quote, hightlight the passage using your mouse cursor and choose copy.
When posting into a new post, on the top of the message block you will see 2 rows of icons for different functions. Choose the 2nd from the end on the bottom row.

quote/quote    this is what you will see when you do this. Each word quote will have a bracket before and after it like this [     ]
Now, quote         /quote between the 2 brackets, line up your cursor , click the mouse and then right click & paste


[quote]BTW, how do folks highlight quotes they have taken from someone as I did here with you, when using them in their posts?

Gene [/quote]

Hope the instructions were clear enough to follow  :).

darn....I just checked this posting and what I specifically wanted to show  didn't.   phoooooey.  Let me see if I can get around this.

okay...this is somewhat better. Just checked it again...this is the best I can do. Just try it, you'll get it.  ;-)

cautious, somewhere around August 8, 2003

[quote]Hope the instructions were clear enough to follow  .[/quote]

Thank you Polka_Dot that worked just fine  :)

Gene

admin, somewhere around August 8, 2003

Hiya Gene,

Interesting!  I don't consider wildcard tasking any different than any other tasking as far as complication to the viewer.  I think everything is equally right there inside us.  

Whether tasking is past, present or future, or about us or about someone else, or about something known or something unknown, I suspect it's all just information.  

I don't consider any of it 'farther away' or 'behind more layers' than others.  If there are layers -- I think they in our belief systems, not in the nature of the information itself.

Do you suppose the assumption that information is 'easier' to get if someone else knows it, could itself hinder performance on targets with info that nobody knows about?  Those are the most interesting targets.  ;-)

Then again, it may also be what one is used to. I think viewers I know that work a lot with frontloaded monitors or close taskers, may learn as much about how to read the monitor as how to read the target.  I think those accustomed to that situation may actually do less well when suddenly the info is unknown to the people they are normally used to 'getting it from' so to speak.

If nothing else, I suppose they are a good challenge! ;-)

PJ

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 8, 2003

[quote]I don't consider any of it 'farther away' or 'behind more layers' than others.  If there are layers -- I think they in our belief systems, not in the nature of the information itself.
[/quote]

I agree.  I think one of the concepts many have is that we have to 'go way out there to get info' or that the data is far removed from us. when it fact, it is a close as our noses. It's all right there in front of us...all the time!

The actual fact is, that we ALL do this accessing of remote information  every day!!....we just aren't accustomed to a conscious recognition of doing it...and even less aware of our individual processes of how we gather this information.

That we are able to do this isn't what is strange. What is strange is our realizing we can and do do it!!

I no longer see all this remote process as mysterious....and this helps a lot. Once the all the mystery and whooo hoos are removed, this process is reduced to a situation we all can handle.

What do you think we are doing when we enter a room and feel the bad undercurrents?....when we see a person and think...hmmm...she's in a rotten mood today, or when choosing a birthday gift for some one and then being told...how did you know!!  I've wanted this for so long  etc.   We read energies all day long --24/7. Remoting is reading energies.  Okay....this is easy to understand right?

The difficulties begin when we try to consciously work with the process. Our rational intellect, our beliefs, our ego's, our 'boxes' all get in the way.  Have any of you noticed the signature saying on my postings?  It says - smart is knowing when to get out of your own way.  I didn't pick this because I thought it was clever.  I learned it the hard way so I EARNED it.  lol   ...I also truly believe it.

One of my greatest learnings so far life has been not being a manipulator. I know longer set things up to make them work out as I want them too (within reason of course). Sure, I try my best to plan things to have them work out as I want/need them to. I always approach everything with an attitude of wanting it to work out.  The part I learned is knowing when to back off-- this was my lesson.  I put some action into play- after that, it's out of my control.  All the millions of variables now have a chance to influence my original action. When I see that it isn't going as I had hoped, do I immediately give in?  no...but I no longer manipulate to force an outcome to my liking.

Why??  I think it's because I have found my own faith in this life. Too many times I haven't gotten what I thought it was I needed/wanted. What did I learn from this?  That what I did get was far better for me than what I even thought to ask for.  No matter what happens-what I'm delt, I always land on my feet. How does this happen?  I learned to get out of my own way and let the greater powers that be do for me what I can't do for myself.

Anyway..what does this have to do with remote viewing and the ability to actually do the process?  I think it comes down to these factors:
1. Know that the information is available
2. Know that you have just as much right to access it as anyone else does.
3. Know that you have the senses to tap into it.
4. Know that this is a natural everyday function.
5. Understand that you are consciously learning a new language of intrepreting energies.
6. Understand that the flaws are not in the data but in your/our translation of 'labeling' the data.
7. The biggie - knowing when to stop the ego from dictating what the data should be, what it can't be etc.

I could have made this about 25 steps, but in the interest of not boring all to tears, I kept it simple...
( & getting out of my own way here  ;-) )

The process of remote viewing (sensing) is easy. It's WE who make it hard  :-/

What do all of you think?

energycritter, somewhere around August 9, 2003

Wow, this wildcard subject really started a lot of good discussion. As I read what everyone has been saying I simply nodded my head and smiled.

Good stuff...it seems that you are all running from any boxing-in of any of this. The extreem cases that challenge time and whatnot to the N'th degree seems to help pull the faith up into the higher SElf.

As many of you have said previously in other posts and whatnot, this RV stuff needs to be practiced in the hardest and most difficult ways imaginable so that we can all see and experience it happening nonetheless. What a faith builder. ;-)

It seems more comfortable to just believe in the extreem and not really understand it.

The wildcard thing tends to bring an extreem to the table and it keeps away the science and brings in the true human ability to do that which exists beyond explination.

Sure, we will continue to try and explain it, but, it needs to remain as unexplainable as possible. No-mind No-thought.

Either way, good thread, good thoughts, good times.

;-)

BC the EC

polkadotpuhjommies, somewhere around August 9, 2003

[quote]The wildcard thing tends to bring an extreem to the table and it keeps away the science and brings in the true human ability to do that which exists beyond explination.

Sure, we will continue to try and explain it, but, it needs to remain as unexplainable as possible. No-mind No-thought.
[/quote]

.....and I have the exact opposite feeling about this.  I don't see the wildcard as being extreme. I see it as pointing out just how simply this energy stuff works--the intent is what drives it. Intent is the gasoline that makes the motor run.

As far as not understanding this process, I would be bonkers,  One thing I am not is a 'blind faith believer". I'm a show me type. ;-) ...and because I am, I have had some wonderful & life changing psychic experiences ~~ and I truly needed to have them or I wouldn't believe 90% of what I do.

Initially, my belief was built on experience of experiences. It was kind of like following cookie crumbs to the big cookie jar  ;-)  Little by little, as I saw things come to pass, or I 'knew' things that were not to be known by the conventional senses, my foundation was built.....not on hearsay, but on personal experience.  This to me is gold!

At this point, because of the slow building of faith and poking fingers in it to see where the weak links are and seeing that most of this psi stuff has held up in the long run, I am more apt now to be a blind faither....( a new word I think!  :o )

    I can't think of many areas in my life where I function without understanding.....it just ain't my nature  :-/

(this also includes understanding that some things can't be understood  ;-) )

energycritter, somewhere around August 11, 2003

I think my crappy ability to communicate using the written word has affected my expression again.

I believe my only point that I wanted to try and make was that the wildcard seems to be very blind and therefore provide high levels of protocol. If the protocol is high and the session is correct then that would be a good experience to experience and it would build faith by seeing results when the target was not even known during the session.

That would also say a lot for the power of intent. We may not be able to explain it all, but, it would be nice to see a wildcard be correct and intent be such a good fuel for the effort to be a success.

I do not know what I am trying to say, I think I am misunderstanding the wildcard.

BC the EC

Scott_Ellis, somewhere around August 12, 2003

Hi All,

Eva - very good point on using RV when you don't know what else to do.

PJ - I agree that the business applications I've come up with are ARV oriented.  I'm sure it's because I'm not a Joe McMoneagle in skill level, but I can't imagine using RV to determine what a product should be.  However, I have no trouble coming up with product ideas without RV.  But marketing research can often be wrong in determining the success of a product and thus an ARV type answer would be very useful if you could trust its accuracy.

On wildcards - I haven't done them as Eva described and set them aside for when needed.  My only concern might be in creating the tasking later while knowing what sessions are in the drawer.

However, I've done lots of sessions where the target isn't chosen until after the session was completed.  I can't tell any difference.  To me it doesn't complicate anything since all the work to figure out where to get the data from isn't done by my conscious mind anyhow.  It just seems to get the information from wherever it's needed, no matter how convoluted, as if by magic (which is what makes RV fun for me).  Tasking IDs, let alone concentrating on them, seem totally unecessary except for record keeping unless I've got more than one session to work in my queue.

Scott

end of messages

[END Topic 76] RV uses in business TKR Remote Viewing Forum July 2003